1. Northampton Charter
Review Committee
Councilor Jesse M. Adams(Vice-Chair)
Colleen Currie (Secretary)
Councilor Marianne L. LaBarge
Councilor David A. Murphy
Alan Seewald (Chair)
Margaret Striebel
Marc
Warner
1OCTOBER 6, 2010 - HEARING ROOM - CITY HALL - 7 P.M.
PRESENT: JESSE ADAMS, COLLEEN CURRIE, MARIANNE LABARGE,
DAVID MURPHY, ALAN SEEWALD, MARGARET STRIEBEL, MARC
WARNER
ATTENDING: MICHAEL BARDSLEY, MARY CLAIRE HIGGINS, DAVID
NARKEWICZ, ANGELA PLASSMAN
MINUTES
Agenda
MR. SEEWALD CALLED THE MEETING TO ORDER AND WELCOMED
NEW MEMBER, MARC WARNER.
1. PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD
NO PUBLIC COMMENT.
2. REVIEW AND APPROVE MINUTES FROM AUGUST 11, 2010
MEETING
COUNCILOR LABARGE MOVED TO APPROVE THE MINUTES.
COUNCILOR ADAMS SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION PASSED
UNANIMOUSLY.
3. PUBLIC FORUM SEEKING INPUT FROM CURRENT AND
FORMER MAYORS, CITY COUNCILORS, AND SCHOOL
COMMITTEE MEMBERS
1

2. MR. SEEWALD STATED BROAD ISSUE IS WHAT WORKS AND WHAT
DOESN’T WORK WITH CURRENT CHARTER. SOME SPECIFIC ISSUES -
TERM LIMITS, MAYOR CHAIRING CITY COUNCIL. HE THEN ASKED
COMMITTEE MEMBERS WHETHER THERE WERE OTHER ISSUES THEY
WOULD LIKE INPUT ON FROM OFFICIALS PRESENT.
COUNCILOR LABARGE - TERM LIMITS, MAYOR CHAIRING COUNCIL
AND SCHOOL COMMITTEE.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - TWO-YEAR LIMITS EXCEPT FOR SCHOOL
COMMITTEE; SHOULD THEY BE LONGER, E.G., FOUR YEARS?
MS. CURRIE - NO PARTICULAR ISSUES; THINKS OUR TASK IS
BROADER.
MS. STRIEBEL - RELATIVE EFFICACY OF CHARTER - RELEVANT TO
OPERATIONS, CONSIDERED IN DECISION-MAKING?
MR. WARNER - COMPARING OTHER CHARTERS - STRONG CITY
MANAGER VS. MAYOR; AT-LARGE VS. DISTRICT REPRESENTATIVES;
OVERRIDES.
COUNCILOR MURPHY - NO ITEMS; INTERESTED IN HEARING FROM
THESE FOLKS ON THEIR TAKE ON WHAT WE’RE DOING.
MR. SEEWALD – THE COMMITTEE HAS TALKED A LOT ABOUT
SCRAPPING CURRENT CHARTER AND RECOMMENDING A NEW
CHARTER BE CREATED.
IF WE RECOMMEND - THOUGHTS RE BEST METHOD - COMMISSION
(HOME RULE) OR SPECIAL ACT? POLITICS AND PUBLIC POLICY
INVOLVED IN DECIDING HOW TO GET A NEW CHARTER.
LET’S START WITH CURRENT MAYOR.
MAYOR CLAIRE HIGGINS- THINKS IT’S NOT HELPFUL FOR HER TO
START.
MR. SEEWALD – LET’S START ON THIS SIDE OF ROOM:
COUNCILOR ANGELA PLASSMAN - WANTS TO HEAR FROM THE
MAYOR.
MAYOR HIGGINS - 1883 - ONE OF OLDEST. ONLY NORTHAMPTON
AND TAUNTON HAVE MAYOR CHAIRING COUNCIL. ANTIQUATED,
2

3. MAYBE FROM TOWN MEETING FORM OF GOVERNMENT THINKS BEST
MAYOR NOT CHAIR. WOULD EMPOWER THE COUNCIL IN A POSITIVE
WAY TO A CERTAIN EXTENT.
DEFINITELY THINKS OF CHARTER. EXAMPLE OF DAM - ASSET OF
WATER DEPARTMENT.
CHARTER COULD BE CLEARER. SOME THINGS COULD BE DONE BY
ORDINANCE, E.G., STRUCTURE OF FIRE DEPARTMENT AND OTHER
DEPARTMENTAL THINGS. DON’T NEED THAT LEVEL OF DETAIL IN
CHARTER.
NOT IN FAVOR OF TERM LIMITS - THAT’S WHAT BALLOT IS FOR
LENGTH OF TERMS - SOME CITIES GOING TO 4-YEAR TERMS FOR
MAYOR - MAKES SOME SENSE, BUT NOT IF MAYOR CONTINUES TO
CHAIR COUNCIL.
SCHOOL COMMITTEE - THINKS MAYOR SHOULD CHAIR - CAME IN
WITH PROP0SITION 2 ½ - TO LINK BUDGET WITH SCHOOL
COMMITTEE - JUST UNDER 60 PERCENT OF BUDGET. ONE VOTE OF
TEN. NO VETO POWER
CITY MANAGER - WORCESTER, CHELSEA, LOWELL, CAMBRIDGE -
MAYOR, CITY COUNCIL, AND CITY MANAGER. BUT HAVE TO PAY A
LOT MORE FOR CITY MANAGER. AMHERST JUST HIRED MANAGER
FOR $127,000. THAT’S PROBABLY BALLPARK.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - VETO POWER WITH COUNCIL, NOT SCHOOL
COMMITTEE.
MAYOR HIGGINS - MAYOR SETS BOTTOM LINE OF SCHOOL
DEPARTMENT; COMMITTEE DECIDES WHERE MONEY GOES.
MAYOR SETS BUDGET FOR CITY, COUNCIL CAN SUBTRACT BUT NOT
ADD TO BUDGET.
MR. WARNER - CAME FROM CAMBRIDGE - CITY MANAGER
ENORMOUS BUDGET - STRONG MANAGER.
MAYOR HIGGINS - CITY HAS HAD HISTORY OF STRONG MANAGERS
MARY FORD, DAVID MUSANTE, SEAN DUNPHY.
3

4. IF ANYTHING OTHER THAN SMALL CHANGES, NEED COMMISSION.
NEEDS TO BE STAFFED AND FUNDED.
WE’VE DONE WELL WITH MAYORS; ENORMOUS CHANGE TO GO TO
CITY MANAGER.
MR. WARNER - MOST OF NEW CHARTERS - WENT TO CITY MANAGERS
[SECRETARY COULD NOT DECIPHER WHAT WAS STATED IN TERMS OF
NUMBERS OF COMMUNITIES BEING DISCUSSED, NUMBERS WHICH
CHOSE CITY MANAGERS, ETC.]
MAYOR HIGGINS - DISAGREED - GREENFIELD, WEST SPRINGFIELD,
EASTHAMPTON BECAME CITIES; DID NOT CHOOSE CITY MANAGER.
STRONG MANAGER - CHELSEA - COMING OUT OF RECEIVERSHIP.
WORCESTER - AFTER SIGNIFICANT MAJOR FINANCIAL DIFFICULTIES.
MR. WARNER - RANDOLPH? WATERTOWN?
MAYOR HIGGINS - TOWN FORM OF GOVERNMENT, NOT CITIES.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - TWO-YEAR TERMS SUFFICIENT? WHY SCHOOL
COMMITTEE WARD 4 YEARS, AT-LARGE 2 YEARS?
MAYOR HIGGINS - SCHOOL COMMITTEE REPRESENTATIVES USED TO
BE ELECTED AT-LARGE; DOESN’T RECALL HOW TERM LENGTHS
DEVELOPED.
EARLIER CHARTER REVIEW COMMITTEE LOOKED AT SOME OF THESE
TERMS.
MOST COMMON CHANGE - 4- YEAR MAYORAL TERM - SPRINGFIELD,
SALEM.
COUNCIL - MORE CONNECTED TO WARDS ON A DAY-TO-DAY BASIS-
2-YEAR TERMS. THINKS IT’S AN OPEN QUESTION. THOUGH BOSTON
HAS FOUR-YEAR MAYOR AND TWO-YEAR COUNCILORS.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - ANY STRUCTURE FOR WARD AND AT-LARGE
COUNCILORS HAVING DIFFERENT LENGTH TERMS?
MAYOR HIGGINS - UP TO CITY OR TOWN, E.G., OF GREENFIELD.
DIFFERENT THAN ANY CHARTER SHE’S SEEN.
4

5. MR. SEEWALD - OPINION RE WARD AND AT-LARGE?
MAYOR HIGGINS - WARD REPRESENTATION IS GOOD IDEA.
MR. SEEWALD - PRESIDENT OF COUNCIL - ONLY AT-LARGE OR CAN IT
BE WARD REPRESENTATIVE?
MAYOR HIGGINS - COUNCIL’S DECISION - THEY ELECT THEIR
PRESIDENT. E.G., NYC - CITIZENS ELECT COUNCIL PRESIDENT; WE
DON’T DO THAT HERE.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - IS DISTRIBUTION BETWEEN WARD AND AT-
LARGE GOOD. COMPARE HOLYOKE NUMBERS AND DISTRIBUTION.
MAYOR HIGGINS - 15 UNWIELDY - IMAGINE HOW LONG MEETINGS
WOULD BE. BELIEVES OUR DISTRIBUTION WORKS WELL.
COUNCILOR MURPHY - WOULD YOU BE CONCERNED IF TERM
LENGTHENED, WOULD OFF-YEAR ELECTION VOTER TURN-OUT BE
NEGATIVELY EFFECTED?
MAYOR HIGGINS - ON FLIP SIDE - SALEM GOOD EXAMPLE - GUY WHO
SUGGESTED 4-YEAR TERM WAS THROWN OUT.
MS. CURRIE - LOW VOTER TURN-OUT IS NATIONAL PROBLEM.
COUNCILOR LABARGE - NUMBER OF SIGNATURES NEEDED TO MAKE
BALLOT - ONLY 50 - COSTS CITY A LOT OF MONEY TO HAVE PRIMARY.
$15-20 THOUSAND.
MAYOR HIGGINS - IT’S REASONABLE TO ASK MAYOR AND AT- LARGE
COUNCILORS TO GET MORE - 100 TO 150 - CITY CLERK, ETC.
MR. SEEWALD - DO YOU SUPPORT ELECTIONS FOR SUCH POSITIONS
- CITY CLERK
MAYOR HIGGINS - NO. SHOULD NOT BE POPULARITY CONTEST –
PROFESSIONAL POSITION. WOULD SUPPORT LIFE TENURE. ISSUE
FOR VOTERS.
COUNCILOR MURPHY - SHE HAD TO RECUSE HERSELF IN RECENT
ELECTION BECAUSE SHE WAS CANDIDATE.
5

6. COUNCILOR ADAMS - OTHER CITIES HAVE DONE AWAY WITH
ELECTED CLERK, ETC.?
MAYOR HIGGINS - OTHER CITIES GETTING RID OF ELECTED CLERK,
TREASURER, SOLICITOR - PROFESSIONAL POSITIONS.
MR. WARNER - LIFE TENURE, BUT HEADS OF DEPARTMENT SERVE AT
PLEASURE OF MAYOR.
MAYOR HIGGINS DISAGREED - MOST ARE IN UNION - APPOINTED,
BUT DISMISSAL MUST BE FOR JUST CAUSE - HIGH LEGAL STANDARD.
MR. SEEWALD CLARIFIED - LIFETIME TENURE FOR THOSE IN
POSITION; NEXT PERSON IS DEPARTMENT HEAD.
MAYOR HIGGINS - CITY CLERK, TREASURER, SOLICITOR
COUNCILOR LABARGE - IF WE DO CHARTER COMMISSION - HOW
DOES THAT WORK?
MAYOR HIGGINS - GAVE EXAMPLE RE COUNCIL’S ACTIONS RE
ASSESSORS, COLLECTOR, AUDITOR. UP TO COUNCIL - MANY
MODELS.
MR. WARNER - EXPLAIN ISSUE RE DAM - WHY WOULDN’T CITY
COUNCIL WANT OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK ON THAT ISSUE.
MAYOR HIGGINS - NOT BEGRUDGING OPPORTUNITY OF CITY
COUNCIL TO SPEAK. IMPORTANT TO KEEP SEPARATE LINES OF
DECISION-MAKING - ASSET OF WATER DEPARTMENT AND RATE
PAYERS.
COUNCILOR DAVID NARKEWICZ - SIMILAR COMMENTS. OLD
CHARTER. COBBLED TOGETHER OVER THE YEARS. RELEVANCE TO
WORK - PULLING HAIR OUT TRYING TO FIGURE OUT - SOME STUFF IN
CHARTER, SOME IN ORDINANCES, SOME IN BOTH.
PULL IT BACK - FRAMING DOCUMENT LIKE A CONSTITUTION –
EXECUTIVE, LEGISLATIVE. ABILITY TO ESTABLISH DEPARTMENTS
WITHIN ORDINANCES. LET COUNCIL DO SO. SENSE IS IT NEEDS TO
BE STARTED FROM SQUARE ONE.
SAMPLE CHARTERS - LESS DETAIL, MOSTLY BASIC STRUCTURE,
LEAVING DETAILS TO ORDINANCES.
6

7. SEPARATION OF POWERS - ODD THAT LEGISLATIVE BODY CHAIRED
BY EXECUTIVE. HE WORKED IN CONGRESS; THOUGHT OF
PRESIDENT ON DAIS OF LEGISLATURE BIZARRE EXCEPT FOR
STATE OF THE UNION ADDRESS.
SCHOOL COMMITTEE - MAYOR ON COMMITTEE - CHAIRING IS
SEPARATE ISSUE.
OUR CHARTER SAYS MAYOR IS CHAIR OF ANY COMMITTEE ON WHICH
S/HE SITS.
BUT IMPORTANT TO CONSIDER SIZE OF SCHOOL BUDGET AND TO
MAINTAIN LINK.
TERMS - WARD AND AT-LARGE GOOD BALANCE. COMPARE
SPRINGFIELD. USED TO BE ALL AT-LARGE. RESULTED IN IMBALANCE
IN REPRESENTATION.
TERM LIMITS - NOT A FAN. BALLOT BOX - PEOPLE DECIDE.
ARTIFICIAL.
LENGTH OF TERMS - COUNCIL - TWO YEARS REASONABLE.
SCHOOL COMMITTEE - NOT SURE OF RATIONALE FOR LONGER TERM.
SEES REASON FOR MAYOR BEING LONGER TERM - ABILITY TO
IMPLEMENT VISION.
WILL BE INTERESTING TO COMPARE OTHER COMMUNITIES.
MR. SEEWALD - IF BACK TO SQUARE ONE - CHARTER COMMISSION
OR SPECIAL ACT?
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - IN EITHER CASE NEED PROFESSIONAL
CONSULTATION. HAD E-MAILED LINK FROM UMASS RE CONSULTING
SERVICE.
MR. SEEWALD - RECOGNIZES BUDGET AND PROFESSIONAL SUPPORT
NECESSARY WITH EITHER METHOD, BUT THERE IS A VERY POLITICAL
PROCESS BY WHICH CHARTER COMMISSION GETS ELECTED, AND
VERY STRICT TIME LINES FOR REPORTS AND TO GET BACK ON THE
BALLOT. – MEANT TO ASK THIS OF MAYOR, TOO – IS THAT SPECIFIC
PROCESS BETTER FOR CITY, OR WOULD IT BE BETTER FOR MAYOR
AND COUNCIL TO APPOINT CITIZENS TO DO WORK?
7

8. COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - SO DISCUSSING TWO OPTIONS. ONE
INVOLVES ELECTING A CHARTER COMMISSION, GETTING REPORTS,
AND GETTING RECOMMENDATIONS ONTO BALLOT. OTHER OPTION IS
TO DO AS WE HAVE IN THE PAST, WHICH IS TO AGREE ON CHANGE
WE WANT, GET APPROVED BY MAJORITY OF CITY COUNCIL, AND
THEN SUBMIT TO LEGISLATURE.
MR. SEEWALD - AND OFTEN LEGISLATURE MAKES YOU PUT IT ON THE
BALLOT. VOTERS GET A SHOT AT IT; QUEX IS HOW MANY SHOTS
HE’S INTERESTED IN PROCESS WHICH IS MORE LIKELY TO SUCCEED.
HOW POLITICIZED? AND DOES POLITICIZED PROCESS MAKE
SUCCESS LESS LIKELY?
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - LAST ATTEMPT - NOT ENOUGH VOTES TO
GET COMMISSION APPOINTED. EITHER WAY, IT’S POLITICIZED.
EITHER WAY, ON THE BALLOT.
ONE ADVANTAGE OF COMMISSION IS INDEPENDENCE OF
MEMBERS - ELECTED INDIVIDUALLY.
MAYOR HIGGINS - THINKS COMMISSION IS WAY TO GO.
COUNCILOR LABARGE - ALSO NOT A FAN OF TERM LIMITS.
HAPPY WITH CURRENT LENGTH OF TERMS.
MS. CURRIE - ASKED COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ HIS POSITION ON
NUMBER OF SIGNATURES NEEDED TO BE ON BALLOT.
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - DEFINITELY SHOULD BE HIGHER. IN
CHARTER. TAKES ACT OF LEGISLATURE TO CHANGE NUMBER.
MR. WARNER - BACK TO ISSUE OF CONTROL. E.G., LANDFILL HOW
DIFFERENT THAN DAM?
MAYOR HIGGINS - DIFFERENT THAN OWNERSHIP OF LAND.
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - DPW DIDN’T MAKE CLEAR DECISION.
MR. WARNER - CHARTER ISSUE?
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - NO. DPW CHOSE NOT TO SEEK
EXPANSION. KNOWS THEY WOULD DIFFER WITH HIS
INTERPRETATION, BUT...
8

9. MR. WARNER - ROLE OF MAYOR MORE CLEARLY DEFINED IN
CHARTER.
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - COUNCIL BETTER DEFINED IN
ORDINANCES.
MR. WARNER - A PROBLEM?
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - YES, IF CITIZEN WANTS TO PICK UP
DOCUMENT AND BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND FRAMEWORK OF
GOVERNMENT.
COUNCILOR MURPHY - LANDFILL - GOOD EXAMPLE - COUNCIL DEALT
WITH AS ZONING ISSUE. FUNDING OR PERMITTING ALSO WAYS TO
DEAL WITH IT.
MS. STRIEBEL - GREATER EMPOWERMENT OF COUNCIL IF MAYOR NOT
CHAIRING - HOW SO?
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - HE’S CHAIRED WHEN MAYOR NOT THERE –
DIFFERENT DYNAMIC. FEELS MORE LEGISLATIVE. WHEN MAYOR
THERE - HAS INFORMATION NEEDED BUT AWKWARD POSITION –
ALSO ADVOCATING ADMINISTRATION’S POSITION.
MS. STRIEBEL - WOULD ALSO ENHANCE ROLE OF MAYOR.
MAYOR HIGGINS - WOULD CLARIFY ROLES. DID WITH FIRE
DEPARTMENT, FINANCE. POLICY, FUNDING, NOT DAY-TO-DAY
OPERATIONS
COUNCILOR ADAMS - ALSO SAW IN DISCUSSION RE DPW FUNDING
FOR FACILITY. MAYOR PRESENTED; PRESIDENT CHAIRED –
EFFECTIVE.
BUT QUESTION - CAN’T MAKE ORDINANCE RE DAM?
MAYOR HIGGINS - RE DAM - CAN’T OVERRIDE CHARTER WITH
ORDINANCE.
RE - DPW FUNDING, E.G., IMPOSSIBLE NOT TO ADVOCATE AS
MAYOR. CLEANER TO SEPARATE ROLES.
COUNCILOR MURPHY - OUR CHARTER DOES NOT ALLOW COUNCIL TO
PLAY MAJOR ROLE IN BUDGET. DIFFERENT CHARTER - SHOULD IT
CHANGE ROLE OF COUNCIL RE BUDGET?
9

10. MAYOR HIGGINS - THINKS SOME OF IT IS A FUNCTION OF STATE
LAW.
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - IF MORE LIKE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT,
WOULD REALLY NEED TO CHANGE STRUCTURE - COUNCIL WOULD
NEED PROFESSIONAL STAFF (ASSESSORS, AUDITOR, FINANCE).
COULD PART-TIME COUNCIL DO THAT? WOULD NEED TO CHANGE
STRUCTURE.
COUNCILOR MURPHY - STATE LEGISLATURE HAS PROFESSIONAL
HELP AND STILL CAN’T FIGURE IT OUT.
MICHAEL BARDSLEY - CONTEXTUAL COMMENTS - WE’RE HERE
BECAUSE OF WORK OF BEST PRACTICES COMMITTEE. ONE OF TEN
CHANGES RECOMMENDED WAS CHARTER STUDY/REVIEW. LOW
VOTER TURNOUT - FEELING OF DISCONNECTION - BEST PRACTICES
SHOWED GREATER LEVEL OF INVOLVEMENT. PAST EFFORTS RE
CHARTER REVIEW - NOT ENOUGH INTEREST TO GET ON BALLOT.
BELIEVES THERE IS INTEREST NOW.
PRESENT CHARTER - LANGUAGE OUTDATED. NOT READILY
ACCESSIBLE.
PIECEMEAL CHANGES OVER THE YEARS - WORDY FOOTNOTES; LOTS
OF SECTIONS DELETED.
NOT ACCESSIBLE; ALMOST UNDEMOCRATIC.
SOME SECTIONS NO LONGER RELEVANT.
SOME SECTIONS MORE APPROPRIATE AS ORDINANCES - EASIER TO
CHANGE ORDINANCES.
SPECIFICS - IN FAVOR OF EXTENDING TERMS OF MAYOR AND
COUNCIL. TWO YEARS TOO SHORT. ESSENTIALLY A YEAR OFF FROM
CAMPAIGNING. THREE OR FOUR YEARS MAY BE BETTER
IN FAVOR OF TERM LIMITS FOR EXECUTIVE. COMPARE FEDERAL -
TERM LIMITS FOR PRESIDENT, NOT LEGISLATURE. KEY ISSUE HERE
IS BALANCE OF POWERS. COUNCILORS ARE PART-TIME. TAKES TIME
TO LEARN JOB.
10

11. CONSIDER VICE-PRESIDENT FOR COUNCIL. SOLICITOR FELT IT WAS
CHARTER ISSUE.
SPECIAL MEETINGS - ROBERT’S RULES - NEED TO BE SPECIFIED HOW
THEY OCCUR.
MR. SEEWALD ASKED RE MAYOR PRESIDING OVER CITY COUNCIL.
MR.BARDSLEY - BELIEVES IT COMES UP WHEN THERE’S OBJECTION
TO STYLE. CAN HAPPEN WITH MAYOR OR CITY COUNCIL PRESIDENT.
BELIEVES IT WAS TO ALLOW COUNCILORS TO PARTICIPATE. CHAIR
CANNOT PARTICIPATE. MUST STEP DOWN FROM CHAIR. DIFFICULT
FOR MAYORS TO BE ABSOLUTELY NEUTRAL. PROS AND CONS.
CITY MANAGER; ELECTION OF CITY CLERK, ETC. - CONSIDER NON-
BINDING REFERENDUM. TO GET ELECTORATE TO WEIGH IN .
OPPORTUNITY FOR DISCUSSION.
CITY CLERK - INDEPENDENCE USEFUL.
HE THINKS MAIN TASK OF COMMITTEE IS TO IDENTIFY KEY ISSUES,
NOT NECESSARILY TO WEIGH IN ON THEM.
CHARTER CONNECTED TO ORDINANCES; ORDINANCES CONNECTED
TO COUNCIL RULES.
SOME OTHER GROUP MAY NEED TO ADDRESS RELATION OF
ORDINANCES AND COUNCIL RULES.
MR. SEEWALD - CHARTER COMMISSIONS OFTEN DO TOTAL REVIEW
TO INCLUDE ORDINANCES.
COUNCILOR LABARGE - PROBLEM WITH NON-BINDING REFERENDUM.
MAYBE MISUNDERSTOOD - KEEPS ISSUES OUT OF PUBLIC
SPOTLIGHT?
MR. BARDSLEY CLARIFIED - BRINGS INTO PUBLIC SPOTLIGHT.
BELIEVES A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO WANT TO BE HEARD ABOUT CITY
GOVERNMENT AND WANT TO BE PART OF DEBATE. EXAMPLE OF
NON-BINDING REFERENDUM ON LANDFILL.
JUST A THOUGHT THAT CAME TO HIM - AS A TOOL TO INVOLVE
PEOPLE.
11

12. E.G., THIS MEETING NOT LISTED ON CITY CALENDAR OR ON THIS
COMMITTEE’S WEBSITE.
COUNCILOR LABARGE - THIS COMMITTEE CAN DO MORE OUTREACH.
THIS COMMITTEE AND WHATEVER DEVELOPS FROM IT CAN HOLD
PUBLIC HEARINGS.
AGREES WITH REFERENDUM IF IT HAS A VALUE - E.G., MONEY ISSUE.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - POSITION RE MAYOR CHAIRING COUNCIL?
MR. BARDSLEY - PROS AND CONS. CHAIR CANNOT PARTICIPATE IN
DEBATE; NEEDS TO STEP AWAY FROM CHAIR - HIS READING OF
RULES. CHAIR TO BE NEUTRAL. COUNCILOR AS CHAIR NOT
REPRESENTING THOSE WHO ELECTED HIM/HER.
MS. STRIEBEL - KNOWS MORE ABOUT TOWN VS. CITY. ARE THERE
OPTIONS? E.G., MODERATOR.
MR. BARDSLEY - REQUIRES CHARTER CHANGE - WOULD HAVE TO
CREATE POSITION.
COUNCILOR MURPHY - IF VOTERS UNDERSTOOD ROLE OF
COUNCILORS, I.E, CHAIR NOT BEING ABLE TO ADVOCATE, PERHAPS
WARD REPRESENTATIVE SHOULD NOT CHAIR. PERHAPS LARGEST
VOTE GETTER IN AT-LARGE ELECTION WOULD BE PRESIDENT –
COULDN’T ADVOCATE. VOTERS WOULD KNOW UP FRONT WARD
COUNCILORS WOULD NOT BE ELIGIBLE TO BE COUNCIL PRESIDENT.
MR. BARDSLEY - IF KNOWN UP FRONT, MAY EFFECT DECISIONS
ABOUT RUNNING FOR POSITION, I.E., WARD VS. AT-LARGE. AND IF
THERE’S A VICE-CHAIR, MIGHT BE OTHER AT-LARGE COUNCILOR.
WORTH CONSIDERATION.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - POINT - SHOULD ALWAYS LEAVE POSSIBILITY
OF WARD COUNCILOR BE PRESIDENT, E.G., EXPERIENCE
MR. WARNER - CHAIR NOT BEING ABLE TO ADVOCATE - SIZE OF
BODY ISSUE - ISN’T CONCERN CUTTING OFF DEBATE?
MR. BARDSLEY - THERE IS MECHANISM - CHAIR STEPS DOWN TO
ADVOCATE; SOMEONE ELSE CHAIRS THAT SEGMENT OF MEETING.
COUNCILOR NARKEWICZ - DIFFERENT INTERPRETATION – RULE
12

13. ABOUT CHAIR DESIGNED FOR LARGER LEGISLATIVE BODIES. CITIES
WHERE MAYOR CHAIRS - RULES PROVIDE NO LOSS OF ABILITY TO
PARTICIPATE AND/OR ADVOCATE. OUR RULE IS MAYOR IS TO BE
IMPARTIAL.
MR. BARDSLEY - COUNCIL CAN MODIFY RULES, INCLUDING
ROBERT’S RULES. DESIGNED FOR WIDE RANGE OF SIZE OF BODIES.
EXEMPTS BODIES LIKE OUR COMMITTEE. COUNCIL DIFFERENT –
LEGISLATIVE.
MAYOR NOT A MEMBER OF COUNCIL - SHOULD NOT BE
INVOLVED IN DEBATE.
MR. SEEWALD - IS CONCERN THAT ROBERT’S RULES DON’T ALLOW
CHAIR TO PARTICIPATE - THAT IT’S A BAD DECISION -
RECOGNIZING SELF, WEIGHING IN ON EVERY ISSUE?
MR. BARDSLEY - A WAY COULD BE FOUND TO ALLOW PARTICIPATION.
MR. SEEWALD - IF STRUCTURE IN PLACE, WOULD IT CHANGE YOUR
OPINION?
MR. BARDSLEY - WORKS EITHER WAY.
COUNCILOR LABARGE - IS POSITION THAT WARD REPRESENTATIVES
SHOULD NOT BE PRESIDENT OR VICE-PRESIDENT?
MR. BARDSLEY - OUT OF CONTEXT - COUNCILOR MURPHY PROPOSED
IDEA - RESPONDING, NOT ENDORSING.
COUNCILOR ANGELA PLASSMAN - CONCERNED ABOUT PUBLIC
NOTIFICATION ABOUT THIS MEETING. SUGGESTS ANOTHER PUBLIC
MEETING - WELL-PUBLICIZED.
IF NEW CHARTER - PUBLIC COMMENT AT WARD LEVEL.
IN FAVOR OF TERM LIMITS - NEW IDEAS AND FRESH BLOOD.
TERM LENGTH - E.G., IF 4-YEAR MAYOR - TWO TERMS.
CITY COUNCILOR - LENGTH OF TERM - LEARNING CURVE - LONGER
TERM MAY BE BETTER - GOOD TO TALK ABOUT IT.
MAYOR AS CHAIR OF COUNCIL AND SCHOOL COMMITTEE - AGREES
SHE NEEDS TO GIVE INPUT. DOES NOT THINK SHE NEEDS TO CHAIR.
13

14. ELECTION OF CITY CLERK - TOO MUCH POWER IN MAYOR’S OFFICE.
OPPOSED CHANGE IN TREASURER’S POSITION.
NUMBER OF SIGNATURES NEEDED TO BE ON BALLOT - DEFINITELY
INCREASE - WHY NOT 50 SIGNATURES FOR EACH WARD?
COMMITTEE APPOINTMENTS - NOW ALL TO MAYOR’S OFFICE; MAYOR
DECIDES WHO IS APPOINTED. SHE BELIEVES CITY COUNCILORS
SHOULD REVIEW AND REPORT TO MAYOR.
MR. SEEWALD - NOW A CHARTER ISSUE. DOES SHE BELIEVE IT
SHOULD BE CHARTER OR ORDINANCE ISSUE? GREATER DETAIL
THAN HE ENVISIONS FOR CHARTER.
COUNCILOR PLASSMAN - DOESN’T KNOW - COUNCILORS DON’T GET
TO SEE APPLICATIONS.
CHARTER LANGUAGE OUTDATED.
SPECIAL MEETINGS - NEEDS TO BE CLARIFIED. MUDDY NOW.
STIPEND FOR CITY COUNCILOR SHOULD BE RAISED. WANT GOOD
PEOPLE IN JOB, NEED TO PAY MORE MONEY.
MR. SEEWALD - HOW MUCH IS IT?
COUNCILOR ADAMS - FIVE THOUSAND FOR COUNCILORS; FIFTY-FIVE
HUNDRED FOR COUNCIL PRESIDENT.
MAYOR HIGGINS - ORDINANCE, NOT CHARTER. ANY COUNCILOR
COULD INTRODUCE ORDINANCE TO CHANGE IT.
COUNCILOR PLASSMAN - MORE PUBLIC INVOLVEMENT IN THIS
PROCESS NEEDED.
MR. SEEWALD - BE ASSURED - THERE WILL BE SPECIFIC PUBLIC
FORUM. WILL CALL ON YOU TO GET CONSTITUENTS INVOLVED. WE’D
HOPE FOR MORE FORMER OFFICIALS TONIGHT.
MS. CURRIE - CLARIFYING LACK OF PUBLIC NOTICE - WE’VE HAD
CONFUSION ABOUT RESPONSIBILITY FOR POSTING. THOUGHT WE
WERE GETTING IT TO THE RIGHT PLACE FOR POSTING ON WEBSITE.
APPARENTLY NOT.
14

15. RE NOTICE T0 MICHAEL BARDSLEY - MY RESPONSIBILITY; HAD
WRONG E-MAIL ADDRESS. ASKED THAT NOTICE BE FORWARDED BY
SOMEONE WHO HAD CURRENT ADDRESS. APPARENTLY DID NOT
HAPPEN. MY FAULT FOR NOT FOLLOWING UP TO MAKE SURE IT HAD
HAPPENED.
RE: PUBLIC FORUM IN PARTICULAR - HAVE DISCUSSED HOW TO
PUBLICIZE - NEWSPAPERS, RADIO, ETC., AND WILL DO SO, IN
ADDITION TO ASKING FOR COUNCILORS ASSISTANCE IN EACH
WARD.
PERSONAL OPINION - WE’VE BEEN DITHERING. IT WOULD HAVE
BEEN EMBARRASSING TO HAVE LARGE NUMBER OF PUBLIC ATTEND.
ACTUALLY TONIGHT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE PUBLIC FORUM, BUT
MINUTES GOT OUT LATE AND WE GOT ORDER OF MEETINGS
CONFUSED. PERSONAL OPINION - BELIEVES THIS MEETING SHOULD
HAVE HAPPENED BEFORE PUBLIC FORUM, AS IT HAS. BUT
OCCURRED BECAUSE A MEETING GOT CANCELLED AND BECAUSE
MINUTES WERE LATE.
ALSO UNTIL THIS MEETING DID NOT REALLY HAVE ISSUES TO BRING
TO PUBLIC FORUM. NOW WE DO. EARLY DISCUSSION LED TO
OPINION THAT CHARTER NEEDS TO BE SCRAPPED. I’VE QUESTIONED
WHY NOT PRESENT THAT AS RECOMMENDATION, AND LET REAL
WORK PROCEED. BUT NOW WE HAVE ISSUES TO BRING FOR PUBLIC
DISCUSSION.
COUNCILOR PLASSMAN - BELIEVES PROCESS SHOULD NOT BE
RUSHED. WISHES MORE PEOPLE HAD ATTENDED TONIGHT.
BELIEVES COUNCILORS SHOULD BE AT THIS MEETING. BIG
CHANGES.
SHE MAY THINK OF OTHER THINGS NOT RAISED TONIGHT. HOPES
THERE’LL BE ANOTHER OPPORTUNITY, SEPARATE FROM PUBLIC
FORUM, FOR COUNCILORS TO COME BACK AFTER DIGESTING WHAT
WE HEARD TONIGHT. UNDERSTAND YOU ALSO HAVE PUBLIC
COMMENT PERIOD.
MR. SEEWALD - WE DO. BUT IF YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO SUBMIT TO
US, WE’LL READ INTO RECORD. FEEL FREE TO CONTACT US AT ANY
TIME.
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16. MAYOR HIGGINS - GOING BACK TO ISSUE OF HOW TO MAKE
CHANGES - IN FAVOR OF CHARTER COMMISSION - EVERYTHING
GOES ON THE BALLOT. NOT INTERESTED IN ADVISORY QUESTIONS.
LEGISLATURE GOING TO ASK FOR IT TO GO ON BALLOT ANYWAY.
NEUTRAL AS TO PROCESS. HOME RULE REVISION OR FULL CHARTER
REVISION. HOME RULE REVISION MAY BE MOST EFFECTIVE, BUT
CHARTER COMMISSION IS BROAD-BASED REPRESENTATION. IN ANY
EVENT, ANY CHANGE SHOULD GO ON BALLOT.
COUNCILOR LABARGE - TO COUNCILOR PLASSMAN - WARD
COUNCILORS AS PRESIDENT.
COUNCILOR PLASSMAN - VOTED FOR YOU (COUNCILOR LABARGE)
THIS YEAR. TRIED TO GET VICE CHAIR - WAS TOLD IT WAS CHARTER
ISSUE.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - WOULDN’T EVEN ENTERTAIN RAISE WHEN CITY
EMPLOYEES NOT GETTING INCREASE.
COUNCILOR PLASSMAN - PURPOSE IS TO GET GOOD PEOPLE - HARD
JOB - A LOT OF WORK.
MR. WARNER - DO YOU WANT MORE RESPONSIBILITY , E.G,
APPOINTMENTS TO COMMITTEES?
COUNCILOR PLASSMAN - SHOULD TAKE ON - OWE TO CONSTITUENTS
NOT ENOUGH BALANCE - PEOPLE WANT TO SERVE - COUNCILORS
CAN’T EVEN SEE APPLICATIONS. LIKE A JOB APPLICATION.
COUNCILOR LABARGE - WE HAVE ACCESS TO APPLICATIONS.
MR. SEEWALD - DOESN’T WANT TO GET INTO THAT LEVEL OF DETAIL.
UNDERSTAND CONCERN OVER BALANCE. BUT THE ISSUE OF ABILITY
TO REVIEW APPLICATIONS NOT RELEVANT TO OUR ROLE.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - CAN WE GET BACK TO AGENDA?
MR. SEEWALD - THANK YOU THE FOUR OF YOU FOR ATTENDING AND
PROVIDING INPUT.
4. WELCOME TO NEW MEMBER (MARC WARNER) AND
REORGANIZATION OF COMMITTEE
16

17. COUNCILOR ADAMS AND OTHER COMMITTEE MEMBERS ASKED MR.
SEEWALD TO CONTINUE TO CHAIR.
MS. CURRIE NOTED THAT MR. SEEWALD HAD GOTTEN OUT THE
AGENDA, KEPT US ON TRACK DURING MEETING.
MR. SEEWALD AGREED TO CHAIR AND TO DO AGENDA, BUT NEEDS
MINUTES SOONER IN ORDER TO DO AGENDA.
MS. CURRIE UNDERSTANDS, AND WILL PROVIDE THEM SOONER.
MAYOR HIGGINS ASKED TO WHOM NOTICE OF MEETING AND
AGENDA HAD BEEN SENT, AND ASKED THAT THEY ALSO BE SENT TO
HER OFFICE. WEBMASTER IS IN HER OFFICE.
MR. SEEWALD CANNOT DO TASKS IN BETWEEN MEETINGS BECAUSE
OF OTHER RESPONSIBILITIES.
COUNCILOR ADAMS WILL BE VICE-CHAIR.
MS. STRIEBEL MOVED FOR APPOINTMENT OF MR. SEEWALD AS CHAIR
AND COUNCILOR ADAMS AS VICE-CHAIR. COUNCILOR LABARGE
SECONDED BOTH MOTIONS. BOTH MOTIONS PASSED UNANIMOUSLY.
5. REVIEW FUTURE MEETING DATES
NOVEMBER 10, DECEMBER 8, JANUARY 12, FEBRUARY 9.
MR. SEEWALD WELCOMED MARC WARNER ONCE AGAIN.
NEXT MEETING - REVIEW WHAT WE HEARD TONIGHT AND SET
AGENDA FOR PUBLIC FORUM.
MS. STRIEBEL WORRIES THAT SOME ASPECTS OF CHARTER REVIEW,
ROLE OF CHARTER, FUNCTION RELATIVE TO CITY GOVERNMENT WILL
BECOME DEBATE ABOUT TERM LIMITS. IT’S A WAY TO GET
PUBLICITY, BUT DOESN’T WANT IT TO BE ONLY ISSUE.
COUNCILOR ADAMS - HOW IS THAT GOING TO HAPPEN?
MR. SEEWALD - SEPARATION OF POWERS SEEMS TO BE BIGGER
ISSUE.
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18. MAYOR HIGGINS - FOR PUBLIC FORUM - FRAME CONVERSATION -
ROLE OF CHARTERS, GOALS OF CHARTER. ABOUT POLICY AND
STRUCTURE NOT PROCEDURE. ROLE OF EXECUTIVE. ROLE OF
LEGISLATURE BRANCH.
6. NEW BUSINESS
7. ADJOURN
COUNCILOR MURPHY MOVED TO ADJOURN. COUNCILOR ADAMS
SECONDED. MOTION PASSED UNANIMOUSLY. (9 :03 P.M.)
18