SlideShare una empresa de Scribd logo
1 de 164
FinnoSummit 2018 Performance – Mexico City
“all our choices are among life stories
that end with our individual deaths.”
Venkatesh Rao
every choice is a choice between
inside or outside the prison cell
PERSONAL REFLECTION
Your secret – No reporting
MEX
LISTEN
“If you are very very quiet
you can hear
the clouds rub against the sky”
Raul Gutierrez, Poet
I’d like
to do nothing for some time
be free
flying and gliding
like birds in the sky
left, right, up, down, up, down,…
defying centrifugal forces
unlimited by time, space, distance, force
like free painting
with myself as the paintbrush
and the sky as canvas
4-dimensional
playful like the birds,
showing little tricks,
challenge and pursue
but not limited
by any form of danger
SOUND
TIME
MEX
BRU
SFO
LOCATION
https://www.google.com/maps/@-27.4547261,-
103.4857855,13036150a,42.3y,270h/data=!3m1!1e3
SITUATIONAL AWARENESS
© Simon Wardley
SENSITIVITY
POSITION & MOVEMENT
SENSITIVITY
MANOEUVRING CHANGE
SO, WHAT TO DO ?
CAN ORGANISATIONS CHANGE?
CAN PEOPLE CHANGE?
WHY WOULD
PEOPLE CHANGE?
STRUCTURE
WHAT IS STRUCTURE?
CAR
metaphor
“Structure drives flow drives behavior drives culture
drives change”
“Change is not hard with the right structure”
Structure has little to do with
reporting lines and P&L booking.
Structure is about patrimony
PATRIMONIO
HERITAGE-GOOD
PATRIMONY IS MEMORY
STRUCTURE IS MEMORY
VIDEO
SPACIAL MEMORY
PROCESS MEMORY
COLLECTIVE MEMORY
LISTENING
OBSERVING
ATTENDING
PERSONAL REFLECTION
Your secret – No reporting
MEX
LEARN
“Assume that the person you are listening to
might know something you don’t”
Jordan Peterson
Carving like Fontana
Calculated, bear-strong, one-time
Wistful sword
Molting hair to horse-head
Beaten, defeaten, dead
Lingering, languishing
Wringing her hair wet
Weary
Stalemate between blame and desire
Toka her platform
Ma her empty-ness, lithe-ness
Lite-ness, Light-ness, Full-less
Her canvas spins into infinity
GOD
Innocent
Apprentice
Mentor
Expert
Master
God
CALIBRATION
LEARNING SPACES
VIDEO
WORK
PLAY
LEARN
OFFICE SPORTSCLUB CLASS
WEEK SATURDAY SUNDAY
STAGES OF OUR LIFE
PARTS OF THE DAY/WEEK
PLACES
ADULT CHILD STUDENT
NATURAL EMERGENT
APPRENTICESHIP IN THE
BRANCH OFFICES
LEARNING IN THE WILD
LEARNING = GETTING BETTER
BETTER AT WHAT?
PLAYING THE GAME
© Simon Wardley
SKIN IN THE GAME
PRISON CELL
Alcatraz
“Evolution can only happen if risk of
extinction is present”
“There is no evolution
without skin in the game”
Nicholas Taleb
LEARNING
GAME PLAY
CONVERSING
PERSONAL REFLECTION
MEX
LEAD
“The first job of a leader is to learn.
Only then can a leader do their
second and third jobs — care and love ”
Umair Haque
Her body toned like that of a sweating racehorse
Her foals let go
Caressing feels like horse riding without bridles
Foaming at the mouth
A steeplechase till the horizon
Heading for the final turn
The finish line of a winner
VIDEO
DRIES VAN NOOTEN
What problem are you trying to solve?
vs.
Create what you truly want
CALIBRATION
LEADING
=
ORGANIZING AND
COORDINATING COHERENCE
COHERENCE
Narrative-Motives-Governance
NARRATIVE
ORGAN BUILDERS
MOTIVES
HIGH QUALITY
FLOWS
“A high quality flow is one where information transfer
is rapid, reliable, and noise free”
HUMAN NOISE
Almost every information flow
(word, sound, tone, dress, posture…)
Is a STATUS transaction
Reciprocity
Prestige
Self serving biases
Power
Hypocrisy
Arrogance and entitlement
“High quality flows need something else than speed,
reliability of noise-freedom.”
“There should be some
dimension/ambition/alignment of “Spiritual, moral
and aesthetical advancement”
Care
Tradition
Craftsmanship
Beauty
Proportion
Sacredness
Infinite games
LEADING
=
CULTIVATING
HIGH QUALITY FLOWS
GOVERNANCE
“As with any open plan office,
the facility has no privacy
and a focus on monitoring of behaviour.”
Simon Terry, about Cessnock Security Prison, Australia
HOPE
Mobs, Moles, Self-Formed Brigades
CITY
CASTLE & SANDBOX
LEADING
DECIDING
CULTIVATING
PERSONAL REFLECTION
Your secret – No reporting
MEX
LISTENING
OBSERVING
ATTENDING
LEARNING
GAME PLAY
CONVERSING
LEADING
DECIDING
CULTIVATING
THE GIFT
Create a Kasbah
Examine your structure
Eradicate conflict, create tension
Combine Patrimonio with Contemporary
Build coherence
of narrative, motives and governance
Cultivate high quality flows
Add a spiritual, moral, and aesthetical dimension
Create what you truly want
Get out of your prison cell
A big thank you to
The Organisers
Andres Fontao & Fermin Bueno
And the full FinnoSummit 2018 team
for letting me do this
All rights reserved
© Petervan 2018
@petervan
Finnosummit Mexico 2018 Petervan

Más contenido relacionado

Último

Dealing with Poor Performance - get the full picture from 3C Performance Mana...
Dealing with Poor Performance - get the full picture from 3C Performance Mana...Dealing with Poor Performance - get the full picture from 3C Performance Mana...
Dealing with Poor Performance - get the full picture from 3C Performance Mana...Hedda Bird
 
BDSM⚡Call Girls in Sector 99 Noida Escorts >༒8448380779 Escort Service
BDSM⚡Call Girls in Sector 99 Noida Escorts >༒8448380779 Escort ServiceBDSM⚡Call Girls in Sector 99 Noida Escorts >༒8448380779 Escort Service
BDSM⚡Call Girls in Sector 99 Noida Escorts >༒8448380779 Escort ServiceDelhi Call girls
 
Continuous Improvement Posters for Learning
Continuous Improvement Posters for LearningContinuous Improvement Posters for Learning
Continuous Improvement Posters for LearningCIToolkit
 
Call Now Pooja Mehta : 7738631006 Door Step Call Girls Rate 100% Satisfactio...
Call Now Pooja Mehta :  7738631006 Door Step Call Girls Rate 100% Satisfactio...Call Now Pooja Mehta :  7738631006 Door Step Call Girls Rate 100% Satisfactio...
Call Now Pooja Mehta : 7738631006 Door Step Call Girls Rate 100% Satisfactio...Pooja Nehwal
 
situational leadership theory by Misba Fathima S
situational leadership theory by Misba Fathima Ssituational leadership theory by Misba Fathima S
situational leadership theory by Misba Fathima Smisbafathima9940
 
internal analysis on strategic management
internal analysis on strategic managementinternal analysis on strategic management
internal analysis on strategic managementharfimakarim
 
Agile Coaching Change Management Framework.pptx
Agile Coaching Change Management Framework.pptxAgile Coaching Change Management Framework.pptx
Agile Coaching Change Management Framework.pptxalinstan901
 
Day 0- Bootcamp Roadmap for PLC Bootcamp
Day 0- Bootcamp Roadmap for PLC BootcampDay 0- Bootcamp Roadmap for PLC Bootcamp
Day 0- Bootcamp Roadmap for PLC BootcampPLCLeadershipDevelop
 
Reviewing and summarization of university ranking system to.pptx
Reviewing and summarization of university ranking system  to.pptxReviewing and summarization of university ranking system  to.pptx
Reviewing and summarization of university ranking system to.pptxAss.Prof. Dr. Mogeeb Mosleh
 
Continuous Improvement Infographics for Learning
Continuous Improvement Infographics for LearningContinuous Improvement Infographics for Learning
Continuous Improvement Infographics for LearningCIToolkit
 
Construction Project Management | Coursera 2024
Construction Project Management | Coursera 2024Construction Project Management | Coursera 2024
Construction Project Management | Coursera 2024Alex Marques
 

Último (20)

Imagine - Creating Healthy Workplaces - Anthony Montgomery.pdf
Imagine - Creating Healthy Workplaces - Anthony Montgomery.pdfImagine - Creating Healthy Workplaces - Anthony Montgomery.pdf
Imagine - Creating Healthy Workplaces - Anthony Montgomery.pdf
 
LoveLocalGov - Chris Twigg, Inner Circle
LoveLocalGov - Chris Twigg, Inner CircleLoveLocalGov - Chris Twigg, Inner Circle
LoveLocalGov - Chris Twigg, Inner Circle
 
Dealing with Poor Performance - get the full picture from 3C Performance Mana...
Dealing with Poor Performance - get the full picture from 3C Performance Mana...Dealing with Poor Performance - get the full picture from 3C Performance Mana...
Dealing with Poor Performance - get the full picture from 3C Performance Mana...
 
BDSM⚡Call Girls in Sector 99 Noida Escorts >༒8448380779 Escort Service
BDSM⚡Call Girls in Sector 99 Noida Escorts >༒8448380779 Escort ServiceBDSM⚡Call Girls in Sector 99 Noida Escorts >༒8448380779 Escort Service
BDSM⚡Call Girls in Sector 99 Noida Escorts >༒8448380779 Escort Service
 
Disrupt or be Disrupted - Kirk Vallis.pdf
Disrupt or be Disrupted - Kirk Vallis.pdfDisrupt or be Disrupted - Kirk Vallis.pdf
Disrupt or be Disrupted - Kirk Vallis.pdf
 
Unlocking the Future - Dr Max Blumberg, Founder of Blumberg Partnership
Unlocking the Future - Dr Max Blumberg, Founder of Blumberg PartnershipUnlocking the Future - Dr Max Blumberg, Founder of Blumberg Partnership
Unlocking the Future - Dr Max Blumberg, Founder of Blumberg Partnership
 
Continuous Improvement Posters for Learning
Continuous Improvement Posters for LearningContinuous Improvement Posters for Learning
Continuous Improvement Posters for Learning
 
Call Now Pooja Mehta : 7738631006 Door Step Call Girls Rate 100% Satisfactio...
Call Now Pooja Mehta :  7738631006 Door Step Call Girls Rate 100% Satisfactio...Call Now Pooja Mehta :  7738631006 Door Step Call Girls Rate 100% Satisfactio...
Call Now Pooja Mehta : 7738631006 Door Step Call Girls Rate 100% Satisfactio...
 
situational leadership theory by Misba Fathima S
situational leadership theory by Misba Fathima Ssituational leadership theory by Misba Fathima S
situational leadership theory by Misba Fathima S
 
internal analysis on strategic management
internal analysis on strategic managementinternal analysis on strategic management
internal analysis on strategic management
 
Agile Coaching Change Management Framework.pptx
Agile Coaching Change Management Framework.pptxAgile Coaching Change Management Framework.pptx
Agile Coaching Change Management Framework.pptx
 
Day 0- Bootcamp Roadmap for PLC Bootcamp
Day 0- Bootcamp Roadmap for PLC BootcampDay 0- Bootcamp Roadmap for PLC Bootcamp
Day 0- Bootcamp Roadmap for PLC Bootcamp
 
Peak Performance & Resilience - Dr Dorian Dugmore
Peak Performance & Resilience - Dr Dorian DugmorePeak Performance & Resilience - Dr Dorian Dugmore
Peak Performance & Resilience - Dr Dorian Dugmore
 
Intro_University_Ranking_Introduction.pptx
Intro_University_Ranking_Introduction.pptxIntro_University_Ranking_Introduction.pptx
Intro_University_Ranking_Introduction.pptx
 
Reviewing and summarization of university ranking system to.pptx
Reviewing and summarization of university ranking system  to.pptxReviewing and summarization of university ranking system  to.pptx
Reviewing and summarization of university ranking system to.pptx
 
Continuous Improvement Infographics for Learning
Continuous Improvement Infographics for LearningContinuous Improvement Infographics for Learning
Continuous Improvement Infographics for Learning
 
Leadership in Crisis - Helio Vogas, Risk & Leadership Keynote Speaker
Leadership in Crisis - Helio Vogas, Risk & Leadership Keynote SpeakerLeadership in Crisis - Helio Vogas, Risk & Leadership Keynote Speaker
Leadership in Crisis - Helio Vogas, Risk & Leadership Keynote Speaker
 
Abortion pills in Jeddah |• +966572737505 ] GET CYTOTEC
Abortion pills in Jeddah |• +966572737505 ] GET CYTOTECAbortion pills in Jeddah |• +966572737505 ] GET CYTOTEC
Abortion pills in Jeddah |• +966572737505 ] GET CYTOTEC
 
Empowering Local Government Frontline Services - Mo Baines.pdf
Empowering Local Government Frontline Services - Mo Baines.pdfEmpowering Local Government Frontline Services - Mo Baines.pdf
Empowering Local Government Frontline Services - Mo Baines.pdf
 
Construction Project Management | Coursera 2024
Construction Project Management | Coursera 2024Construction Project Management | Coursera 2024
Construction Project Management | Coursera 2024
 

Destacado

2024 State of Marketing Report – by Hubspot
2024 State of Marketing Report – by Hubspot2024 State of Marketing Report – by Hubspot
2024 State of Marketing Report – by HubspotMarius Sescu
 
Everything You Need To Know About ChatGPT
Everything You Need To Know About ChatGPTEverything You Need To Know About ChatGPT
Everything You Need To Know About ChatGPTExpeed Software
 
Product Design Trends in 2024 | Teenage Engineerings
Product Design Trends in 2024 | Teenage EngineeringsProduct Design Trends in 2024 | Teenage Engineerings
Product Design Trends in 2024 | Teenage EngineeringsPixeldarts
 
How Race, Age and Gender Shape Attitudes Towards Mental Health
How Race, Age and Gender Shape Attitudes Towards Mental HealthHow Race, Age and Gender Shape Attitudes Towards Mental Health
How Race, Age and Gender Shape Attitudes Towards Mental HealthThinkNow
 
AI Trends in Creative Operations 2024 by Artwork Flow.pdf
AI Trends in Creative Operations 2024 by Artwork Flow.pdfAI Trends in Creative Operations 2024 by Artwork Flow.pdf
AI Trends in Creative Operations 2024 by Artwork Flow.pdfmarketingartwork
 
PEPSICO Presentation to CAGNY Conference Feb 2024
PEPSICO Presentation to CAGNY Conference Feb 2024PEPSICO Presentation to CAGNY Conference Feb 2024
PEPSICO Presentation to CAGNY Conference Feb 2024Neil Kimberley
 
Content Methodology: A Best Practices Report (Webinar)
Content Methodology: A Best Practices Report (Webinar)Content Methodology: A Best Practices Report (Webinar)
Content Methodology: A Best Practices Report (Webinar)contently
 
How to Prepare For a Successful Job Search for 2024
How to Prepare For a Successful Job Search for 2024How to Prepare For a Successful Job Search for 2024
How to Prepare For a Successful Job Search for 2024Albert Qian
 
Social Media Marketing Trends 2024 // The Global Indie Insights
Social Media Marketing Trends 2024 // The Global Indie InsightsSocial Media Marketing Trends 2024 // The Global Indie Insights
Social Media Marketing Trends 2024 // The Global Indie InsightsKurio // The Social Media Age(ncy)
 
Trends In Paid Search: Navigating The Digital Landscape In 2024
Trends In Paid Search: Navigating The Digital Landscape In 2024Trends In Paid Search: Navigating The Digital Landscape In 2024
Trends In Paid Search: Navigating The Digital Landscape In 2024Search Engine Journal
 
5 Public speaking tips from TED - Visualized summary
5 Public speaking tips from TED - Visualized summary5 Public speaking tips from TED - Visualized summary
5 Public speaking tips from TED - Visualized summarySpeakerHub
 
ChatGPT and the Future of Work - Clark Boyd
ChatGPT and the Future of Work - Clark Boyd ChatGPT and the Future of Work - Clark Boyd
ChatGPT and the Future of Work - Clark Boyd Clark Boyd
 
Getting into the tech field. what next
Getting into the tech field. what next Getting into the tech field. what next
Getting into the tech field. what next Tessa Mero
 
Google's Just Not That Into You: Understanding Core Updates & Search Intent
Google's Just Not That Into You: Understanding Core Updates & Search IntentGoogle's Just Not That Into You: Understanding Core Updates & Search Intent
Google's Just Not That Into You: Understanding Core Updates & Search IntentLily Ray
 
Time Management & Productivity - Best Practices
Time Management & Productivity -  Best PracticesTime Management & Productivity -  Best Practices
Time Management & Productivity - Best PracticesVit Horky
 
The six step guide to practical project management
The six step guide to practical project managementThe six step guide to practical project management
The six step guide to practical project managementMindGenius
 
Beginners Guide to TikTok for Search - Rachel Pearson - We are Tilt __ Bright...
Beginners Guide to TikTok for Search - Rachel Pearson - We are Tilt __ Bright...Beginners Guide to TikTok for Search - Rachel Pearson - We are Tilt __ Bright...
Beginners Guide to TikTok for Search - Rachel Pearson - We are Tilt __ Bright...RachelPearson36
 

Destacado (20)

2024 State of Marketing Report – by Hubspot
2024 State of Marketing Report – by Hubspot2024 State of Marketing Report – by Hubspot
2024 State of Marketing Report – by Hubspot
 
Everything You Need To Know About ChatGPT
Everything You Need To Know About ChatGPTEverything You Need To Know About ChatGPT
Everything You Need To Know About ChatGPT
 
Product Design Trends in 2024 | Teenage Engineerings
Product Design Trends in 2024 | Teenage EngineeringsProduct Design Trends in 2024 | Teenage Engineerings
Product Design Trends in 2024 | Teenage Engineerings
 
How Race, Age and Gender Shape Attitudes Towards Mental Health
How Race, Age and Gender Shape Attitudes Towards Mental HealthHow Race, Age and Gender Shape Attitudes Towards Mental Health
How Race, Age and Gender Shape Attitudes Towards Mental Health
 
AI Trends in Creative Operations 2024 by Artwork Flow.pdf
AI Trends in Creative Operations 2024 by Artwork Flow.pdfAI Trends in Creative Operations 2024 by Artwork Flow.pdf
AI Trends in Creative Operations 2024 by Artwork Flow.pdf
 
Skeleton Culture Code
Skeleton Culture CodeSkeleton Culture Code
Skeleton Culture Code
 
PEPSICO Presentation to CAGNY Conference Feb 2024
PEPSICO Presentation to CAGNY Conference Feb 2024PEPSICO Presentation to CAGNY Conference Feb 2024
PEPSICO Presentation to CAGNY Conference Feb 2024
 
Content Methodology: A Best Practices Report (Webinar)
Content Methodology: A Best Practices Report (Webinar)Content Methodology: A Best Practices Report (Webinar)
Content Methodology: A Best Practices Report (Webinar)
 
How to Prepare For a Successful Job Search for 2024
How to Prepare For a Successful Job Search for 2024How to Prepare For a Successful Job Search for 2024
How to Prepare For a Successful Job Search for 2024
 
Social Media Marketing Trends 2024 // The Global Indie Insights
Social Media Marketing Trends 2024 // The Global Indie InsightsSocial Media Marketing Trends 2024 // The Global Indie Insights
Social Media Marketing Trends 2024 // The Global Indie Insights
 
Trends In Paid Search: Navigating The Digital Landscape In 2024
Trends In Paid Search: Navigating The Digital Landscape In 2024Trends In Paid Search: Navigating The Digital Landscape In 2024
Trends In Paid Search: Navigating The Digital Landscape In 2024
 
5 Public speaking tips from TED - Visualized summary
5 Public speaking tips from TED - Visualized summary5 Public speaking tips from TED - Visualized summary
5 Public speaking tips from TED - Visualized summary
 
ChatGPT and the Future of Work - Clark Boyd
ChatGPT and the Future of Work - Clark Boyd ChatGPT and the Future of Work - Clark Boyd
ChatGPT and the Future of Work - Clark Boyd
 
Getting into the tech field. what next
Getting into the tech field. what next Getting into the tech field. what next
Getting into the tech field. what next
 
Google's Just Not That Into You: Understanding Core Updates & Search Intent
Google's Just Not That Into You: Understanding Core Updates & Search IntentGoogle's Just Not That Into You: Understanding Core Updates & Search Intent
Google's Just Not That Into You: Understanding Core Updates & Search Intent
 
How to have difficult conversations
How to have difficult conversations How to have difficult conversations
How to have difficult conversations
 
Introduction to Data Science
Introduction to Data ScienceIntroduction to Data Science
Introduction to Data Science
 
Time Management & Productivity - Best Practices
Time Management & Productivity -  Best PracticesTime Management & Productivity -  Best Practices
Time Management & Productivity - Best Practices
 
The six step guide to practical project management
The six step guide to practical project managementThe six step guide to practical project management
The six step guide to practical project management
 
Beginners Guide to TikTok for Search - Rachel Pearson - We are Tilt __ Bright...
Beginners Guide to TikTok for Search - Rachel Pearson - We are Tilt __ Bright...Beginners Guide to TikTok for Search - Rachel Pearson - We are Tilt __ Bright...
Beginners Guide to TikTok for Search - Rachel Pearson - We are Tilt __ Bright...
 

Finnosummit Mexico 2018 Petervan

Notas del editor

  1. WHO RECOGNISES THIS? Your organisation gets a new board, new executive teams, has re-orgs. In your change/innovation efforts you see an oscillating pattern of building up capacity, and then downsizing, and then, later, building up capacity again. The reason for that is structural CONFLICT. It’s sister dynamic is structural TENSION. That’s what this talk is about.
  2. Compelling event
  3. The Turin Papyrus Map was discovered at Deir el-Medina (Thebes, Egypt) by Bernardino Drovetti sometime before 1824 AD. It is now preserved in Museo Egizio(Turin, Italy). the map was drawn about 1160 BC by the well-known Scribe-of-the-Tomb Amennakhte, son of Ipuy. It was prepared for Ramesses IV's quarrying expedition to the Wadi Hammamat in the Eastern Desert, which exposes Precambrian rocks of the Arabian-Nubian Shield. The purpose of the expedition was to obtain blocks of bekhen-stone (metagraywacke sandstone) to be used for statues of the king.
  4. Ableton Push for slides
  5. ABLETON PUSH AFTER THIS SLIDE
  6. ISE SHINTO SHRINE, JAPAN Rebuild every 20 years for around 1,300 years To preserve process knowledge
  7. Het Nationaal Museum in Rio de Janeiro, een van de belangrijkste musea van Brazilië en Zuid-Amerika, is zondagavond door een grote uitslaande brand verwoest. De autoriteiten vrezen dat het grootste deel van de museumcollectie verloren is gegaan.
  8. Het Nationaal Museum in Rio de Janeiro, een van de belangrijkste musea van Brazilië en Zuid-Amerika, is zondagavond door een grote uitslaande brand verwoest. De autoriteiten vrezen dat het grootste deel van de museumcollectie verloren is gegaan.
  9. RIGHT INSIDE (Back of BackCover)
  10. RIGHT INSIDE (Back of BackCover)
  11. START HALF WAY WITH ABLETON PUSH
  12. Story of the forbidden drummer
  13. The forbidden is sad. And then becomes angry, and protests
  14. Some years ago, I created an online movement “Corporate Rebels United” gathering more than 1,000 change agents. I have exhausted the rebel type. I have put off the mask of rebellion. It did not help me at all in being successful in and for the organization I worked for. It feels cool but does not create anything. It just challenges, makes aware, gives energy and stress, and structural conflict. Change within the organisation is not a grass roots movement. Over the years, we have seen that without the support and even demand of leadership, change will not be sustainable.
  15. EVERYTHING IMPORTANT HAS TO DO WITH AESTHETICS BIG DRIES EXPO 2 YEARS AGO, ONE OF THE MOST AESTHETIC ARREST MOMENTS ’Aesthetic Arrest’. It best describes the feeling we have when in the presence of a work of art, or any object of beauty, that has that ‘wow’ quality, that stops us in our tracks. We feel somehow altered by the encounter, taken outside of ourselves, elevated somehow KEY MESSAGE: BE A CREATOR OF MAGIC, the WOW QUALITY > BUT THAT REQUIRES PREP AND TENACITY I SAW IT WITH DRIES, I SAW IT WITH CHRISTO (ING EXPO BRUSSELS LAST WEEK)
  16. NEXT SLIDE IS ABLETON PUSH
  17. Ableton Push
  18. You don’ say “What a deep hamburger”, “What a deep drummer”
  19. You don’ say “What a deep hamburger”, “What a deep drummer”
  20. You don’ say “What a deep hamburger”, “What a deep drummer”